#406 How to redefine success, break free from old patterns & repeating cycles, and achieve true fulfillment, with Christine Jewell.

Christine Jewell  0:00  
The hardest place to read the label is from inside the jar. Yeah. So when we're inside our circumstance we can't see necessarily like, it's so obvious to everybody else. We're like a walking billboard.

Agi Keramidas  0:15  
You're listening to personal development mastery, the podcast that empowers you with a simple, consistent actions to take that will help you create a life of purpose and fulfilment. I'm your host, Agi Keramidas. And this is episode 406. Have you ever found yourself repeating some kind of psyche over and over different events but similar patterns? If yes, would you like to break free from that? By listening today, you will gain insights on how to break free from negative repeating cycles, those recurring patterns ingrained in our mindset. And you will also understand the value of trusting your inner compass and embracing authenticity. Whatever your aids it's a fascinating conversation and I hope you will find it of tremendous value. Before we dive in, if you enjoy listening and appreciate what we'll do in here, the simple quick favour I'm asking of you is to click the subscribe button. Now let's get started. 

Agi Keramidas  1:34  
It is my pleasure to speak with Christine Jewell. Christine, you are an author, keynote speaker and faith based executive coach with over 25 years of experience. You are also a high level athlete, multiple business owner, podcast host wife and mother of six. You are passionate about helping high achieving individuals break free from superficial lives, redefine success and create fulfilling and purposeful relationships and lives. Christine, welcome to the show. I'm delighted to speak with you today.

Christine Jewell  2:13  
Thank you for having me What an honour to be here.

Agi Keramidas  2:16  
It's wonderful to have you here. And there are quite a few things that I would like to discuss with you. And let me begin, maybe by your story, and in particular, that story of you call it rebuilding from the assets. And I think many people can relate to that. So I want to ask you, if you can give the short version of the transition period, because I understand that you were very successful in your career and with multiple entrepreneurial projects. At the same time, professionally, a professional athlete and a mother and but it was not that was not all that was fulfilling your life. So if you can take me to the time before the transition point or the show, we can just get an idea of how your life was then. And then we'll speak about what changed it? Yes.

Christine Jewell  3:31  
Okay, I will absolutely do that. And before I even start with my story, I would love to just kind of give you all the punch line of that I think that people can relate to is, you know, two things. Number one, we always repeat what we've experienced in our past until we decide to break this cycle. So we're always repeating what our body remembers, and the programming that's been installed. So just think about that, you know, as people are listening, and also I want to invite people to remind, you know, consider that we're what God has for you. Next, you're gonna need to pack light you're needed, gonna take only what's essential, and let go of the rest. And so my story is just, you know, I write about this in the book, but I grew up in a home where the modelling was a very high performer, high achiever. My father came from the CIA background, navy, CIA, ultra high performer always driving, always pushing, operated as a lone wolf. I mean, you have to kind of to be in that space. And so I observed this, this drive this strong drive, always having to prove yourself and succeed and perform, but also the drive that really destroyed my father through alcoholism and addictions to other things that ended up destroying him. And so I started at the gates saying, You know what, I'm never going to be like him. I'm never going to be anything like him. So I set out on a quest to be the exact opposite of everything my father was, except for The fuel was the same, I still needed to prove to myself and prove to everyone else that I was going to be different and successful. But I was going to do a different. And here's the thing I started at 23, building my first business with my ex husband, we built a CRM company, you know, over 10 years, we had a highly successful, you know, life from the outside the house, the vacations, the business, $7 million that year, 40 people in an office overseas, but everything was built on sand. Right? It was like a big illusion of everything on the outside. And then that ended up in a divorce. So that completely burned to the ground because we didn't have anything solid glue holding our marriage together. And we didn't have like true unity in our marriage. You know, we were just doing what the world taught us to do. And then I repeat it again for another 10 years. Okay, so I'm 48. This year, I'll be 48. But, you know, by the time I was 30, I found myself divorced with three very young children, and walking away from this entire life and lifestyle that we've built and having to rebuild everything from the ground up. But if you don't deal with the root of what created that pattern in the first place, you end up repeating it. So as I talked about, in my book, I'm a warrior, I have bought the programme that everything has to be hard and conquered. And I, it takes a lot to beat me down. And so I went through another 10 year cycle of repeating the same lesson again, building another business, from the ground up, was very successful financially, you know, built a team, we had hundreds of clients, I was training and coaching people at a world class level as an athlete. I was, you know, rebuilt my whole identity, but again, found myself disconnected in my relationships, exhausted in my body, you know, 10 years later, facedown on the floor going, what am I doing wrong? Why do I still feel so empty, so disconnected? You know, my face is on the outside of the building, I look like this really fit, beautiful woman who I should have it all. On the outside of maybe it looks like I have it all. But on the inside, I was like screaming and so frustrated and tired. And that was really the moment where I said, I remember like God coming and saying, Okay, are you done? Like, are you done? Doing this your way doing this? Would you like another 10 years like this? And I thought, No, never, I'm not doing this ever again, this way. There's nothing wrong with success, having beautiful things. But I knew I wanted an amazing marriage. And I couldn't figure that out. I knew I wanted a different spiritual life, I knew I wanted to have freedom, mental freedom, emotional freedom from being slave to my business or slave to you know, my clients or to schedule and everything. So I really made a decision, I was not going to create, again, from the fuel of pressure, of fear of the programme I knew, and I needed to learn a completely new way to do life business relationship that really was fueled from a place of peace, mental freedom, and to be honest, like inspiration, instead of the drive to move away from something. So here we are. Today, I'm in North Carolina with my husband, my amazing husband, which is the right man that God has for me. And we have a joint business together. And we're doing work that we love. And we have six kids between the two of us and it's amazing. And we operate from from inspiration, and we're co creating together and it's very life giving instead of life draining.

Agi Keramidas  8:50  
Absolutely. And there were many things with what you said that thank you for sharing this in such a succinct way this story. You mentioned that's caught my attention that you repeated a second cycle, because you hadn't realised that the first one was resigning. Can you tell me when did you realise that they were cycles that it was not just another series of events that were related in some way or in other ways that there was something similar driving this over and over again, because many of us find ourselves in situations like this, but don't necessarily realise that it is the same pattern. Repeating the thing is something else and then something else but yeah, so that would be interesting to you know, clarify with more. Yes,

Christine Jewell  9:46  
let's go into that. I'm so glad you brought that up. You're the first one that's actually asked me that even though to me it's so glaringly obvious, but it's obvious when we're on the other side or someone on the outside is looking at you know, I heard somebody say the other day, the hardest place to read the label is from inside the jar. Yeah. So when we're inside our circumstance, we can't see necessarily like, it's so obvious to everybody else. We're like a walking will billboard. But the easiest place to, we're always we are repeating patterns, we are living patterns all the time. 95% of what we do is just repeating repetition, we're in the automatic nervous system, right? So whether we think we are or we think we're not, you are either repeating a pattern or creating a new pattern. And so because we always repeat what we remember, in our nervous system, and our mindset, right, our belief systems, and everything else is just overflow of that. And so, I did get to the place where you're absolutely right, Aggie, I was like, Oh, it must be him. It must be my employees. Clearly, I need to fire this person and get somebody new. And I got tired of actually saying it was always someone else. Because I realised that everywhere I went, there, I was reliving the same relationship dynamic. Now the person's name was different, it was a different man. But it was the same dynamic it was, it was the same drama, it was the same chaos, it was the same emotional tension, that was just showing up with a different name with a different outfit, it was the same core issues within our team. Right? It was the same core, like the roots are the same, even though the leaves look different, you know? And so finally, you start going okay, wait a second, what are the common denominators here? First of all, everywhere I go, whether it's work, relationship, whatever, these things keep presenting themselves, so maybe I get to look at who the one is that's showing up and creating these things, consciously or unconsciously? And then what are the things? What are the familiar drivers and wounds that we repeat? And so I started looking at three things. Number one, I What was the pattern of my identity? What I believed about myself, who I thought I was, who I thought I wasn't? Secondly, is like, what was really driving me? Right? Was I chasing something of feeling something and what was the driver of that which was often to be honest, when I got real with myself, I realised like, anger was a lot of the fuel that I had been creating from, or pain, like wanting to avoid something of my past, or never experienced what my mom experienced in her marriage, what my dad ended up with, like, we're always running away from something or running to something. So I had to really get real with myself and say, Okay, what am I running away from? And what do I what am I running to that I think this next relationship or this next business deal, or this next thing is going to provide for me because we're always chasing something, because we think it's going to give us something that's often available to us now, like pieces available now. Now, once I get the boat, or once I get the next trip for once I get the net, you know, it's available now. And the problem is, you know, we're always living often living in the gap. I know you referenced Dan Sullivan on one of the recent podcasts, I was listening to reverse engineer, he talks about living in the gap and, and we do this, it's like we're on the beach, we're looking at the sunset and we're not even we're not enjoying the sunset or the beach, we're living like in the water in between all the time, treading getting tired instead of like, can I enjoy and be where I am, and experience you know, peace, freedom, joy, whatever it is here, while also being excited about where we're going.

Agi Keramidas  13:46  
If you enjoy this episode, can you think of one person that would find it useful and share it with them, I'd really appreciate it, it helps the show grow. And you will also be adding value to people you care about. Thank you. And now let's get back to the episode. 

Agi Keramidas  14:05  
It's a great point and I'll go back to something you said that you stopped at some point creating from fear and from the previous to the programme that you had and you started creating or CO creating you said was your husband out of inspiration. So my question is, you know what, when we are, let's say we are in the the other state of creating based on a fear or programmes or wanting to prove something to ourselves or to others, as you were saying are different examples. The challenges in that case, I think they are obvious and I think a bit more a bit less each of us his face is when we go against what We're meant we do, there are a lot of challenges happening. My question is the the opposite when you took the other direction when you created out of inspiration, what are the still challenges? Or was then it was an easy flow and things started happening for you. And, you know, I don't I don't mean, of course that you didn't have to do work. But I mean, what are the different kinds of challenges? I don't know if there is if the question is, is it?

Christine Jewell  15:38  
I think so well, I'll just share what's coming through for me and my heart. You know, we said at the beginning, we're just gonna talk heart to heart. So exactly.

Agi Keramidas  15:45  
My question was not in my notes. It just came right now. So, okay, there is a good reason that it popped up. So let me ask

Christine Jewell  15:54  
it. Yes. Okay. So let's go back to that. We're always either creating from inspiration, or desperation, anxiety, something we're trying to avoid, I don't want to feel the pain of losing that thing. I don't want to feel the pain of my spouse being disappointed, right, the and I just wanted to bring that up real quick, because a lot of us, it's not so much that we're afraid, the anxiety the anxiousness is that we don't want to experience an uncomfortable feeling. So what we're doing, we call it fear, but it's actually like, I am worried about feeling something that's going to be uncomfortable for me. And I don't want to feel that it's funny, because we're feeling it anyways, because we're anxious and pressured. And so when when I made the decision to say, You know what, like, I'm going to operate from inspiration, in speeder, right? In spirit, if you look at the root of that word, like to in the breath, in the breath of God connected to the breath of God connected to the Spirit. And I think that's so beautiful that that is the root word means you're breathing in. And you're literally operating in union with and from the very breath of God that is alive in huge inspiration, which is ultimate creative power, which is so beautiful. So here's the shift, right? When now we're saying, Okay, I'm gonna operate from inspiration, a often will move you always not often always moves you into the unfamiliar territory, the unknown. And it's designed that way, because we're going into the blank canvas of the new the new identity, the new creation, what God has for us, we're going into Eve, right, and it requires partnership with the Spirit. But also, it's it's not familiar, and it's not supposed to be because if it was familiar, you wouldn't be repeating the past. So you wouldn't, you know, it would not be inspiration, it will just be comfort and repetition. So I think that when we raise our hand and we say, Yes, I'm gonna, that sounds amazing. I want to co create, and I want to be operating from inspiration, get ready, because it's also it's very exciting. But now the excitement that used to be worrying about an unfavourable outcome becomes the anticipation, and the excitement and the wonder of expecting a favourable outcome that you have no idea what that's going to look like. So you start trading your anxiety for anticipation, and excitement in the unknown, which requires a lot of faith. And so what, and a lot of courage, right? And a lot of trust, because now you have to, you don't have a solid future to trust yourself. Because you don't know what you're gonna create. You don't know what the outcome like when we were talking about the podcast, you've done 400. I've done you know, 150 plus one before, like, now, I'm inspired when I'm stretching the conversations. But when I started this process, I didn't know who's gonna listen, or people gonna respond. Like there was so much having to show up and face all of those insecurities of, well, who do you think you are? Is anyone gonna listen? Like, what if nobody shows up? And you have to just press in and you have to trust. And remember, I've done hard things before. I've done uncomfortable things before. You know, I've done new things before I've created before. And so we get our trust from looking backwards, but our faith by looking forwards. And so it's, you know, the challenges that come is you're going to be tested on all of your insecurities. You're going to be tested on all of the doubts, you know, and you're going to need to learn how to normalise, operating in the unknown as as a norm and that requires you to cultivate a muscle. I believe it's a muscle trust is a muscle confidence is a muscle faith is a muscle and a willingness. I would say willingness is probably the biggest thing to do things we've never done before to go places we've never gone before to have conversations we've never thought of having before. To share from our heart like we You never have before. So that's one of the key questions I asked people is like, are you willing to go, where you've never gone before, because you're ready, things are gonna start showing up that you've never done before, and you're gonna start feeling really inadequate and insecure. Congratulations, for moving in the right direction. Right? If it's familiar, you're probably moving in the wrong direction.

Agi Keramidas  20:26  
Yes, you know, that phrase that all progress hovers outside the comfort zone. But by definition, it can't happen in the comfort zone, you can't change the it's the same. I liked what you said about getting your trust by looking back backwards and remembering what you have achieved and so on. There was something else that I want to hear your thoughts about, regarding the outcome, and detaching from the outcome in particular, because it is, well, we very much very well know that we, we can only control our effort and not the outcome. But somehow, many of us find ourselves clinging into the outcome and waiting for the outcome. So my question to you is, how would you advise someone to detach or, you know, attached less to the outcome of water doing and to focus more on? What's here?

Christine Jewell  21:36  
I would say two things. Number one, is really deciding, decisiveness is so powerful. When we're sort of like, maybe I'll just kind of see, you know, we're straddling two worlds, we're kind of going forward and backwards, but really decide where will I get my security from? Because often we think the outcome is going to be the thing that gives us the security, right, if we just know that we're going to close this deal, or we just I know she's going to be happy when I get home. And I have this conversation with her. I know, right? And it's an illusion, this, our security is awesome if our security is based in the outcome, and we're only going to feel secure. If we get that specific thing. We're going to operate insecure like the entire time, right? And we're setting ourselves up for massive disappointment if the outcome changes, or looks different, there's so much and so not only do we have an awful time in the process, but we're really hinging our security on an illusion. Right? And so it's like, what do I want to feel secure? And, and you said something great, like, I know, I can put security and me showing up and doing the best that I can, I can get my security from knowing, you know, if I do my part, I could trust that God is going to do his part. That's, you know, I'm a faith based coach, I can put my security in knowing that if every time in the past where I have moved forward, in alignment with what I knew that I knew that I knew was the right move, ultimately, it always worked out in my favour. You know, what are you going to put your security because if it's the outcome, I'm gonna say often, almost again, almost always, the outcome has looked very different than I originally thought it was gonna look like. Right in the second thing of that is really also deciding how do I want to experience this process? You know, the, the writing of the book is a simple example. Like I wrote this book, it's, it's not a little book. It's like it was a labour of love, you know. And there were some moments where I found myself starting to go into the programme of getting really attached to like, oh, well, what will people think? Is it going to be successful? How many are we going to sell? And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, I want to how do I want to experience writing this book? How do I want to remember my experience of sitting down and writing and being with this message? And, like, in Can I really enjoy it, like I wanted to enjoy like a fine meal, you know, I'm Italian. We love long, slow meals. And then I moved to the US. And it's like fast food everywhere people are eating while they're driving. Like, how do you want to experience eating this meal? Do you just want to swallow it whole and just not digested and not assimilate it and not enjoy it? And then you're sick to your stomach? Because you're just you rushed it? Or do you want to really enjoy it and savour and savour who you're becoming? And so I think that has been the biggest thing for me. And I just want to say I think it's some of that does come from my Italian roots. Because I feel growing up in Italy gave me that Jawad de vivre, even though that's fresh, like the joy, of like, enjoying and squeezing every minute out of life, instead of rushing to the next thing that we're going to try to experience and then we're not even there for that experience. So it's like how do I want to experience this moment? Dating? You know, my husband? I started dating and everyone's like, well, how is this gonna work? You're in two different countries, like, where are you going to get married, if people were asking all of these questions of the logistics and how fast and when, and I'm like, I just want to get to know this man. Like, I just want to enjoy him, and enjoy us and, you know, enjoy this season, and it will ripen over time, you know, and it did. So, those two things, decide where you will place your security and decide how you want to experience it, because we're always choosing.

Agi Keramidas  25:38  
That's true. And thank you for reminding us of this truth that every single moment we're choosing what how our experience is no other, no other what happens with the outside. Our experience hovers on the inside, it doesn't happen out there. It's happens in here. So we

Christine Jewell  26:00  
choose in that we're choosing, we're always choosing and also like that was a decision I made and a programme that I spoke every day was I refuse to operate from pressure anymore. So like, I'm not going to rush. While going back to the meal analogy. I'm not going to rush this book, the podcast, I'm not going to rush this date night, I'm not going to rush because when I rush things, I miss things. And that was a big switch just making that decisions. And then the action is like, Okay, we get, we get presented with opportunities where people deadline timeline, and you want to cram more things in, but I said no, I'm gonna have space in my life, and my schedule to enjoy, digest and operate from from really being able to experience this thing. Which adds depth to our life. Right? years, years of experience, right? Yes,

Agi Keramidas  26:58  
yes, indeed. Tell me about the book, then Christine drops the armour, which is very recently who you really so tell me who is it for who would really enjoy and benefit reading it? Yes.

Christine Jewell  27:18  
Well, I say that the war dropped, the armour was written for the ultra high achiever, who has really felt the tension of straddling two worlds, you know, chasing the earthly pursuit of success and growth and all of the things that you know, I think, are in our encoded in our DNA, we're designed to grow we're designed to create we're designed to to expand and increase, but also not lose ourselves in the process. So bridging the gap between the earthly pursuits and desires and really the eternal things that don't have timelines like freedom and peace and joy right here right now. So how do I live the fullness of life? And it's written for that person that has been fighting battles their whole life and building businesses and building things. And maybe it's finding themselves at a crossroads, asking the same question that I was, was like, there must be a different way to do this exceptionally well, while also really, really experiencing a rich life, not only financially but emotional, emotionally rich, relationally, rich, you know, rich and health rich, and memories rich and experiences rich and everything. And so that's really who it's written for. And I'll say there's three main parts, the first part of the book is releasing the past. And that is about releasing the mental programmes, the operating systems, the old identities, the wounding, all of this stuff that we carry, that really is just crushing us and holding us down. And it's, you know, I said, we need to pack light. So the first section is really about releasing a lot of unforgiveness that we have towards others and ourselves, like we carry a lot of things, bitterness, resentment, regret, the second part is really about igniting our faith. So how to build trust, how to build our confidence, how to build our faith, how to really hear, you know, that voice of God within to connect with the Spirit. And the third section is really the stepping into the next season. Who who are you being called your identity, you know, the mission, the calling now, and it's never what it used to be, because where you work was always preparing you for where you're going, you know, and so, we're always just evolving. Our identity is changing throughout our lives. Our I believe our, our calling, you know, changes to different seasons, we have a core calling, but it evolves and sometimes if we stay too long in one season, we start to become ill. Right, stagnant. So that's really at it's a journey from the head to the heart from one operating reality into another and to really experience what I believe is the rich life that we are created for. What

Agi Keramidas  29:58  
What does the armour represent, what is it? Yeah, metaphor of that.

Christine Jewell  30:05  
The metaphor of the hour, you know, I use the analogy, the Yeah, the armour. You know, I earlier on when I was sharing my story, I shared that, you know, growing up, my father was my hero, he was my first love little girl and her father, there's nothing like that, right. But he was the model of what love looked like I was watching him, how he treated me how he treated my mother. And you know, from a young age, we learn who we need to be to protect ourselves, who we need to be to be loved, who, where it's safe to be us. And we unconsciously start putting on all this self protection, right? Well, I need to protect myself, I'm my own provider, I need to provide for myself, because my father left, I need to provide for myself, because this person, I need to protect myself because the place that I thought was safe actually isn't safe. And so we put on all these protective layers that really create like walls, even in our most intimate relationships. And I hear this where, you know, people will say, I don't know how to get close to my wife, or my husband, like I really want to experience more intimacy, but I just, there's like a wall there. And the wall is all those layers that we have put on of who we need to be or who we need to pretend to be or what we need it to be to get through a season. And so we're I believe, that we're wearing so much emotional, mental and spiritual weight that needs to be removed. And I I spent 10 years as a in Toronto when I had my business in Toronto as a holistic health and performance coach. And I would have many, many people come in with autoimmune diseases, chronic pain, extra weight. And you know, when it came down to it, they didn't need just another diet. They didn't need just another workout programme. That's what they thought they needed. Most of them had been packing on all of this emotional weight, which became physical weight, right, or the pain in their body was always an A manifestation or an outcome of years of just holding things in suppressing repressing, not speaking up in their marriage, not you know, not being who they are chameleon like pretending to please everyone. And it carries so much weight. And it makes us sick from the inside out. So dropping the weight is releasing everything and anything that's inside of us. That is now making us sick, weighing us down or holding us back from this this next season that God's calling us into.

Agi Keramidas  32:37  
Thank you. Thank you for clarifying that. And reminding again that that Kristin, welcome, you direct listeners that wants to find out more and connect. And

Christine Jewell  32:52  
the book well, of course, one of the things I'm doing for all we're on a big podcast tour right now we're doing 100 podcast episodes in a very short amount of time and what we're doing yet, and I'm giving away the first chapter, along with the love letter, the first there's a there's a series of love letters in this book, they're called the warrior letters. So I'm giving that away to all of the listeners of your podcast so they can go to the Christine jewel.com/drop it, drop it and then you'll get the first chapter, the warrior letter for free. If you love it, you'll there'll be a link there where you can buy the book, I would love for you to buy the book. And we are creating a really beautiful experience around the book where when you opt in for the free resources that go with it. You'll also get an audio bundle of guided visualisations, a journal with the self reflection questions, as well as a playlist. So we're creating a full experience around this because we don't want this just to be a book that people read and put on their bookshelf. I want it to move you at a cellular level, like I want it to affect your soul and your bones. And so we are creating a multi dimensional experience audio visual writing, reading, so that whether you're a kinesthetic learner or a visual learner or an audio learner, it is going to penetrate you so that Christine jewel.com/drop it that's the first place and if you opt in for that you'll get the links to everything else.

Agi Keramidas  34:21  
Thank you I liked very much so the that this multi dimensional approach and let's say holistic learning. It's not just intellectual it is it has. But yeah, we learn by experience anyway, we don't learn by just reading something we have to do it. So brings us back to what we were saying earlier on. Today. Christina have two final quick questions that I always ask my guests and the first one is What does personal development mean to you?

Christine Jewell  35:00  
I believe that to personal development to me is remembering more and more of the woman I'm already created to be, and I already am. And I'm removing the layers. So every time I lean in, I develop, I'm not really developing myself, I'm actually remembering and recovering, more and more, and I'm just removing the garbage. You know, there's a famous quote that says, It's not who we think we are, that holds us back, it's who we think we're not. And so I really believe it's about removing all of the noise, and really stepping into the full skin, of who you are, and what you're here to do. And there's a unique purpose and design for each of us. And I believe that when we find that intersection, where we know that we're living in that pocket, we come alive in ways that we never have experienced before.

Agi Keramidas  35:52  
Thank you. And hypothetically, if you could go back in time and meet your 18 year old self, what's one piece of advice you would give her

Christine Jewell  36:04  
I would just give that 18 year old version of me to really trust, trust, trust, trust, your inner knowing your inner get, be the light, be 100% of who you are, and never water yourself down. Because every time you dim yourself down, you water yourself down and you start doubting yourself, you are going to get off on the wrong exit. It's going to be the wrong exit. And then you're going to learn some hard lessons. And then you're gonna get back on. So if you can stay with that North Campus and be 100% of who you were created to be shine your light. Don't apologise for being here, there's only one of you there's and again, you know, everything beautiful happens when we're being fully, authentically who were created to be. And I believe that, ultimately, whether people are doing coaching, or personal development really like the answers are already inside of us. We're just being remapped. We're just being redirected back to the truth that we already know. So I would say you already know, you already know just trust and move and release anything that is trying to you know, don't don't compromise yourself.

Agi Keramidas  37:13  
Thank you. I think that would apart from a 18 year old advice for an 18 year old. I think that advice would apply to Oles Yes. Because then I want to thank you very much for this conversation. I found it very useful. And they it was very insightful, and there weren't many actionable things I could take from it. I want to wish you all the very best with your life and with your mission. And I will leave it to you for your parting wisdom.

Christine Jewell  37:54  
Yes, I will stand where I started, because I believe this is the three line and really the message that I have that I believe everything that you are waiting for longing for seeking is actually waiting for you. And it's on the other side of you letting go of the things that you are holding on so tightly to. So everything you are looking for is actually waiting on you. It's already looking for you. And I want you to imagine that your fists are clenched really tight and you're holding on so tightly to something and you're just like I can't like but I can't anything but this anything but this I'll do anything that this thing that you're holding on so tightly. That's the thing. That's the key. That opens the next door.

Agi Keramidas  38:45  
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